External Editor

[DBR_ONIX]

Hey
I'm not totaly sure where to put this, but this seems the best place..
Anyway..
Basicly it's an idea for a program (Or programme? ).. An external mission editor..

Theres a few reasons something like this would be usefull..
1. You don't have to load OFP, which is good if you have loads of addons, and OFP takes around 5 mins to load (I've split them up in to mod folders, but it's still not quick)
2. No more alt-tabing out of OFP to edit scripts
3. It could be upgraded with stuff like internal scripting editor
4. 3D editing window? (Like WRPEdit's one?), that makes vertical placement easier (If you've ever seen the Delta Force map editors.. The 3d view, you can nudge the selection item around in all directions, and rotate it etc).. No more long setpos stuff
5. Better group things.. Like the "F2 Groups" button thing does in the internal editor, but better.. say like a squad of soldiers, in a heli, flying etc
6. Get rid of the fact that if you place a waypoint on a unit, you can't edit the unit
Hmm, even if that does sound like a feture list for something I've made.. It's just a bunch of ideas that can be changed around/improved..

The layout of the mission.sqm isn't that complicated (Close enough to the description.ext file).. Esp when compared to ones like the P3D, RTM etc that people have made programs for

I can't code in anything like C, or C++ (PHP, HTML, pBASIC, and sqs are all ), but I guess it wouldn't be that hard to do..
Even if you could just place units, waypoints and triggers, and edit the units, and save the file (To PBO?) it would be really usefull

Anyone interested in making this/anyone got any other ideas?
- Ben

[dmakatra]

The 3d window would be a nice idea. I don't find any of the other features really intresting as it ain't that bad alt-tabbing(takes a second, xept me who got some weirdo gamma bug so itll sometimes go all dark when I alt-tab, can be fixed by alt-tabbing againt though). BTW, You said you were gonna get a haircut now on MSN, wtf u doin in front of the comp you muddabitch!! ;D

:beat: *Gets Shot* :beat:

[macguba]

I think you can edit scripts inside the mission editor already, using either ECP or vektorboson's (?) script console thing.   Though I'm not sure.

If that's true you virtually have a 3D placement thing already.  Just set yourself up in the right place and alter the code.

[Mud_Spike]

1. You don't have to load OFP, which is good if you have loads of addons, and OFP takes around 5 mins to load (I've split them up in to mod folders, but it's still not quick)

You'd probably want to RUN the mission every now and then though, and having OPF running makes this somewhat easier.

2. No more alt-tabing out of OFP to edit scripts

Might be a hazzle, but OPF supports alt-tabbing so much better than 99% of all other screen-grabbing  (not in the screenshot way, more possesively) applications.

6. Get rid of the fact that if you place a waypoint on a unit, you can't edit the unit

Press and hold Shift to reveal obscured items.

This might be off-thread but on-topic;
What I'd really like to see is an emacs mode for .sqs, .ext, .sqf, etc. I began writing one for .sqs but got bored quickly and reverted to sh-mode (which kind of works).
And c-mode works pretty well for .sqf files, but still, syntax highlighting isnt as good as it could be.

[macguba]

For speeding up loading the game, are you familiar with -nosplash?

"C:\Program Files\Codemasters\Operation Flashpoint\FLASHPOINTBETA.EXE" -nosplash

[BibiPhoque]

An external editor would be just great. You could add absolutely any feature that you could think about, to simplify mission making. Imagine you want a crate full of ammo. With the original editor, you would have to create the script (any way you want), save it to the mission directory, go back to OFP, put the crate, and put the needed init line. With the new editor, you'd just have to click on something like "Add -> Ammo & Weapons -> Ammo Crate", save, and there you are! Of course, you could change the init line of the crate, but there would be already one!

I'd really love to use such an editor. Imagine the things you could do : modify the properties of an entire group of soldiers, put a group inside a chopper by clicking & draging... It would be amazing.

There's more ! A thing I found really strange in OFP, is that you have to actually PLACE a soldier on the map, even if it is set as in cargo. With the new editor, you could double click on the chopper, add a soldier in it, or see the ones already aboard. Then on the map, there would be some small colored squares along with the chopper, one for each soldier in it.

[h-]

As was stated, you may want to preview the mission every now and then, so how would you do it with an external editor so that you actually would have less alt-tabbing and other hasle??
You still would need to have OFP running, then when needing preview you would need to save the mission in the external editor, then go to OFP, load the mission (as otherwise you couldn't test the externally made mission as there's no autoupdate in OFP) then hit preview, then abort, then alt-tab out back to the external editor, change things, save the mission in the external editor, go back to OFP, load the mission, preview, abort,alt-tab out etc. etc....
I think you get the drift?
External editor could actually double the alt-tabbing...

The mission editor now in OFP is the best/easiest to use that I have ever seen...
Try the stuff like DromEd (Thief 2 editor, a b s o l u t e l y nightmareously horrifying...) or the one in Rogue Spear (or was there one?) and you will see what I'm talking about...

The drag 'n drop would be a useable feature to have though, as would be the 3D window hasle...
Hopefully BIS include that kind of things in OFP2 ....

I don't see any external editor easing the mission editing, which is the most simple and easiest thing to do in OFP...

Maybe couple of the younger generations have been spoiled so badly that even the mission making in OFP should happen with opening a window, typing in something like "mission, SP, 3 objectives, medium hard" and then hitting enter and vóila, a mission has been made ;D ;D (no pun intended )

What we would need is a program for making the drop[] scripts, as it's so horribly annoying to write/debug

[DBR_ONIX]

I see what you mean about all the alt-tabing to test it, HateR_Kint..
But the stuff that could be done with an external mission ed, like applying the same INIT field to all of the selected soldiers, no more screwed up mission.sqm files with addons that aren't there (Yeah I know it's easy to edit in notepad.. But not easier for some people)

About the -nosplash thing.. I know about it.. But I don't use it, with a few mod folders, the boot up is longer than that boot up screen.. So it gives me something to look at

Mud_Spike : Thanks I didn't know about the shift button
Y'learn something new every week.. Uh, day..

I think you can edit scripts inside the mission editor already, using either ECP or vektorboson's (?) script console thing.  Though I'm not sure.

I've seen that.. It's Vektorboson's I'm sure.. It's a dialouge box that you can open in the editor.. But you can't save the scripts or anything.. I don't think you can acctualy write scripts in it (), just exec commands..

If that's true you virtually have a 3D placement thing already.  Just set yourself up in the right place and alter the code.

But that invloves a lot of "preview > Look > abort > edit code > preview" etc
And if you want to layout stuff like walls.. It's no fun at all
Against the 3d window..
You can press the up arrow a few times, and it's perfectly placed

Yeah, the draging and dropping would be a cool idea

Other ideas, when you change the height of a plane (In it's properties box? A height).. You can make the ext mission editor automaticly set it's flying height (The flyinheight command)
And maybe a option (In a set up menu?) That when ever you save it, it exports to PBO as well..
Oh, and a backup button, that saves the misison.sqs file to mission.bak.. Orr.. saves the PBO into a zip
Oh, a huge improvement.. A undo button!
Ever placed hundreds of waypoints, all with lots of code in them (:hmm:), and then accidently pressed delete on the unit (Not that I have )

So would anyone be interested/know someone who is interested in making a start on a program like this?
- Ben

[DBR_ONIX]

In stead of modifing the post, I'll just add the stuff here.. THe last post is long enought already

The mission editor now in OFP is the best/easiest to use that I have ever seen...
Try the stuff like DromEd (Thief 2 editor, a b s o l u t e l y nightmareously horrifying...) or the one in Rogue Spear (or was there one?) and you will see what I'm talking about...

Yeah, I tried the RS Raven SHeild editors.. The unreal ed stuff..   I could not understand it at all.. Just to make a small, simple building takes weeks

Maybe couple of the younger generations have been spoiled so badly that even the mission making in OFP should happen with opening a window, typing in something like "mission, SP, 3 objectives, medium hard" and then hitting enter and vóila, a mission has been made   (no pun intended  )

Now there's an idea..

There already is something like that, the templates thing in OFP it kidna like that

What we would need is a program for making the drop[] scripts, as it's so horribly annoying to write/debug  

;D YEAH!!!!!
Like you can choose what sorta thing (Fire, water, smoke), and select a colour from a pallete, choose the direction, the possition, gravity (All through dropdown boxes, text boxes and stuff)
And maybe things like presets, like for fire, and you can change parameters for it etc

Hey! Maybe it could be incorporated into the ext mission editors...
- Ben

[BibiPhoque]

External editor could actually double the alt-tabbing...

That's a pretty wrong statement... We're all used to alt-tabbing because scripts can't be edited in-game (well it's possible with ECP apparently, but I doubt it's as convenient). So it won't double alt-tabbing, you'll only need to alt-tab when you want to test you're mission, like when you modify a script.

[dmakatra]

I think it's more work for the guy who makes the program than it's actually worth...

:beat: *Gets Shot* :beat:

[BibiPhoque]

Yes, maybe you're right. But it's just an idea, and who knows, maybe someone will be interested in making it =)

[NoMaD]

Greets. If your not wanting to load up you mods do this.
Setup a second shortcut to  Wichever OFP.exe you use to start game.
In TARGET have this ( right click on OFP icon goto properties)..
"C:\ProgramFiles\Codemasters\OperationFlashpoint\FLASHPOINTBETA.EXE" -nosplash -nomap
Thats assuming you have it installed in default directory ( FLASHPOINTBETA.EXE) is the .exe i use.
That loads no mods. You could also run OFP in a window, no alt tabbing out.

[OliverPA]

Just a thought: Have you ever noticed that there's a myriad of editors for all kinds of more or less specialized tasks out there but very, very few are any good and even less actually ease development? Maybe it's just me.. editor choice is more of a spiritual thing
I find it much easier to use a well established editor (currently once again ultraedit) than wait a year or more until the new ofp-only editor is any good...
I'd be more interested in sharing ofp-related macros...

eg. filename to CfgSounds declaration:

Code: [Select]

InsertMode
ColumnModeOff
HexOff
UnixReOn
Key END
StartSelect
Key Ctrl+LEFT ARROW
Key Ctrl+LEFT ARROW
EndSelect
Key DEL
Clipboard 1
StartSelect
Key Ctrl+LEFT ARROW
Copy
EndSelect
Key END
StartSelect
Key HOME
Clipboard 2
Copy
EndSelect
Key DEL
"class v_"
Clipboard 1
Paste
"
{
  name=""
Paste
"";
sound[]={""
Clipboard 2
Paste
"",0.1,1.0};
titles[]={0,""};
"
StartSelect
Key HOME
EndSelect
"};"
ToggleBookmark
Top
Key END
","v_"
Clipboard 1
Paste
"""
GotoBookMark
ToggleBookmark
Key DOWN ARROW
Clipboard 0


[General Barron]

I think it's more work for the guy who makes the program than it's actually worth...

:beat: *Gets Shot* :beat:

I totally agree with Armstrong here. What you're looking for would be a TON of work to program, and considering how small of an improvement it would be over the default editor, I can't see how it would be worth anybody's time. Most of the improvements that have been suggested aren't really improvements; they are just automated ways to do very simple tasks (making a custom ammo crate, setting a plane's flyin height, etc). You can't really make the editor more "user friendly" without taking away its universal functionality.