Copyright - Addon Makers Be Aware

[Messiah]

ive got a 3.56 cents comment (inflation + exchange rates)

i once made a mission using some music from Moby - now, of course this music is copyright, but i emailed mute records with a request that i may use the music - it was a small selection of the track, and had been modified...

i said full credit would of course been given and i also mentioned how moby was a god  

they agreed to let me use the music - u see, it never hurts to ask  

[Sefe]

Like I said, it doesnÂ't hurt anyone, who cares if thereÂ's a MOHAA skin in OFP?

It would hurt the ones who created the skins. Those skins are commercial goods. Someone had to pay the guys (and gals) who make those skins. I'd be pissed off too if someone would rip of my work or the work I have invested my money in. What I don't understand is that people would instantly agree that it would be stealing if it would a painting, a sculpture etc., but not if it's it's digital counterpart. The only difference is that one can be copied with a few mouse clicks and for the other one you need a burglar's exam...

EA doesnÂ't have the right to sue some1 for that skin. TheyÂ're just after the money.

They sure as hell have any right in the world to sue anyone who uses those skins without their permission. And what's so wrong that they are after the money? It's a business. They have invested money in creating the textures, so they have any right to make money with them. Not only you, also EA and it's employees have bills to pay. If anyone would be allowed to use their protected material, they could close their business tomorrow.

[Noon416]

To add to Sefe's wisdom...

It's also covered by the EULA (End User Licence Agreement) you agree to when you install the gaming (or other) software.

I can't look one up at the moment to get the exact wording

But basically, taking the skin/model/texture out of a game for use elsewhere would be classed either under reverse engineering, disassembly, or one of the other restrictions listed in that sentence.

And because you have to accept the agreement (ie: you have to consciously click to get past it), it becomes legally binding like any other contract you put your signature to.

So I would say (personal opinion only here) that they would have a very strong case in the situation described above.

[Fishion]

to add my 3.82 cents (inflation + excange rates + tax adjusted)

I think if you talk to them politely you can convice them,
that
a) if you have to pull back your work (after releasing a BETA mostly) it makes for real bad publicity for the said company
b) it makes for good publicity if you do that with their support. I mean let's take the Coca Cola Map example.
Who is going to play that map? Right people who like the
game, and they'd think "wow cool Coca Cola supports us games...they like us" (of course a couch potato drinks more coke...). And usually it should be very controvercial
c) There is a small "dent" in the way the legal system works. They can only sue/ask/whatever a few single persons. IMO eventually someone will make the addon, and if it is out in the public, it's kinda hard to stop it again. (Yes you could aks each and every site not to host it...but that's like illegal copies of musik isn't it?).
I'm not saying that's the way it should be done, no but
even compaies should be aware of this, and the reaction
by the OFP community. So most likely we'll such an addon, even if it is out of protest.

-Fishion

[dmakatra]

Just one Q to sefe cause he seem to know so much about this copyright law.

If I made a letÂ's say coca-cola can and I didnÂ't know coca-cola excist, can they sue me then?

[Sefe]

Yes

[KTottE]

It's actually your legal obligation to find out what you can and can't do Armstrong. It's the same with laws in foreign countries. If I go to germany or USA, I can't say "Well gee officer, I didn't know your laws because I'm from Sweden", you have to find out what goes and what doesn't.

But in the words of Sefe:

Yes

[Sefe]

It's not actually an obligation. No-one can force you to inform yourself about the legal situation. But if you don't, everything you do goes to your own risk. Ie.: the law applies to everyone, wether they know it or not (with very, very few exceptions). Once you have a claim against someone else you'll be thankful for that.

But we're drifting away again...

[Tomb]

  ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.... (*sleeps*)

[cpt.Hawkeyez]

Three words: The system Sux! Every single CEO is exactly the same all they are interested in is making money except for a select few who are really interested in quality and satisfaction. Anyways good job OFPEC keep up the good work. Also a shoutout to all the addon makers. some of you are better than BIS thats why one day game publishers will make a engine and just give total freedom to the users to add stuff make stuff all the game company would have to do is moderate stuff added. wellg etting off topic. great site great people keep up the awesome work.

[Sefe]

If they wouldn't make any money with their games, there would be none...

[ebud]

Let's try this as a question.

A company freely allows parts of it's game, such as textures, to be edited and redistributed for mods for the main game... Ghost Recon for instance. Now if a person used those files for another game, then that would be illegal. How and why? They are freely distributed for modding purposes, who's to say how they are modded?

There was a mod recently distributed for Ghost Recon that used Unreal characters. Silly in my opinion, but it was made and distributed quite publicly. Now I'm safe to assume that this would be a case where the modder and hosts for the mod could be sued. Is this correct? Even if the models and textures were made available for modding by the parent company?

Just wondering.

Ebud

[Sefe]

It depends on the license agreement.

The owner of the intellectual proeperty can decide who is allowed to do what with his property. This is the same as for any non-intellectual property. If someone would take your car and drive around the block, this surely wouldn't hurt you. Or what if he'd just get in and out again? Would that hurt you? Still you can forbid that someone to do it. Simply because your car is your property and you can do everything you want with it. You can smash it, burn it or do something even more senseless with it. It's your property. I don't think anyone of you would consider that to be unfair.

So why do so many people consider it unfair that the owner of intellectual property (which can be much more valuable than any non-intellectual property) can do what he wants with what belongs to him? The owner of some textures can lock them on his hard drive, he can even delete them. You should be rather thankful that he lets you use them. So don't ever complain that he limits the use.

To come back to the question. Unlike Noon said, the EULA doesn't forbid anything. If the EULA would be the foundation of the right to sue you, you couldn't sue software pirates because they never signed the EULA. The rule is that (with a few exceptions) you aren't allowed to do anything with the subject of the EULA (ie. the protected material that is licensed to the licensee). The EULA allows you to do certain things with the protected material. So the named mod could be sued if using the textures for another game wouldn't be covered by the EULA.

And as for that certain case: Do you think anyone who makes his material available for modification intends that they are used for a competiting game? It's simply not the same if you modify the game the textures are from than to use the textures in another game. Just imagine this case: Two games, game A with excellent graphics but rather poor gameplay and game B with mediocre graphics but a new ground braking gameplay. The makers of game A are generous enought to allow mods to use the in-game textures. Some smartass mod makers then think they could use the textures for game B and then advertise "the gameplay of game B with the textures of game A". Why should anyone play game A again when game B has the same graphics but with a better gameplay? When the makers of game A opened the textures for the mod makers, they inteded to improve their game and make it more attractive, not to make another game so attractive that you wouldn't play (or buy) the own product anymore. To me, this makes perfect sense.

[ebud]

Thanks for you insight Sefe.